rc2 and 1.0

Ray · 2005-02-19 20:40:03

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Who <b>IS</b> that masked man?

watts · 2005-02-19 21:01:24

I’ve been sitting on my hands to keep from responding to this thread in the past, but I’m finally moved to do so by irritation with the “if you don’t like the way things are done, get out” tone things are veering toward. Look, guys: the expectation of better communication about Textpattern’s development exists because it’s been implied or promised in the past, from setting up dev.textpattern.com to Dean’s statement early on in this thread that there would be nightly tarballs.

All of this angst — no, really, all of it — would have been short-circuited long ago if these statements had been followed through, the tracking tools already in place had continued to be used. Instead, we’re in a situation where it doesn’t look from the outside as if any development has happened in four months. (And at risk of being pointed, the current release as defined as “the one on the download page” is a slight regression from the June 2004 release in terms of full functionality.)

Expressing concern and frustration with the current state of affairs is not an unreasonable response. And telling those expressing that concern to sit down and shut up doesn’t strike me as very appropriate.

Last edited by watts (2005-02-19 21:02:33)

RussLipton · 2005-02-19 21:49:24

You know the saying: don’t come between two spouses fighting when you’re an outsider or …

I’ve been fooling with TXP locally just for fun for months but have small ownership; increased a bit lately by linking up with TXD and some … plans … but. And if you think TXP doc is bad, try Tinderbox, which I PAY FOR. And love.

TXP is just a small matter of code. Yes. Chicken scratches. But, really, computers are nothing but dreams and poetry. Ditto open source but more so: add some politics and philosophy. And Dave Winer’s own slogan always fits: it really is worse than it appears.

Me? I don’t even want to know what Dean ‘does’ or ‘doesn’t do’.

Yes, there are indeed better-or-worse disclosure styles. I think things went a bit haywire when early January was promised and silence ensued.

Still, my deal with open source after 25 years into computers (I know why they suck far more than you do) is this: no express or implied warranties. Seriously. Heck, that’s (99% or more) true of the crap you pay for as well.

Communities vote on open source every day by contributing code (or not); documenting (or not); using (or not) and, most of all, forking (or not). The code is mine. I can take what Dean and others (plug-in’s) have done and do whatever I want. Nothing stops me. What could possibly be cooler than stealing their intellectual property? Only it really is a gift that they gave to me. Score one for the good guys in this world.

Using TXP is risky and it would be even if Dean detailed his progress every day:

“January 12: five cups of coffee. I hate TXP.”
“January 13: switched to Beaujolais … can’t remember what I did to the code today but woohoo do I feel tres bon!”

WordPress? Yes. MT? Risky. Even if you’re paying. Or should I have said WordStar? DEC? Windoze? It’s worse than it appears everywhere.

As an outsider (here I go), I don’t really think anyone has been seriously out-of-line on this thread-narrative. Hey, passion is cool. Otherwise, why bother with open source? Mean-ness is uncool because it yokes passion with anger. In that respect, it is only about code. Death awaits (Life 2.0). TXP? No biggie.

One of the neatest things about open source is how different each product/community is. The TXP community is markedly different from the WordPess community which is very different than the MT (plug-in) community. And so it goes. I know how they are different but that would be too much of a digression even for this post.

Someday, there will be a TXP 1.0. It will definitely suck. That’s good; otherwise, it wouldn’t be any fun. Thirty years from now, one of the young guys here will use (almost) the exact same words as me on some descendant of forums/CMSes … and not even remember they are doing it.

Just as I don’t remember that postal letter I received about CP/M and the Trash-80. Now, THEY were cool. To me. Then.

Last edited by RussLipton (2005-02-19 22:31:50)

ubernostrum · 2005-02-19 22:45:58

watts: That’s the thing. I don’t see a communication problem. There’s as much communication as there’s ever been. After 1.0 I think it should change, but for now we’re talking about beta software that, until now, has largely been written and maintained by one man. This forum and the news we get through it have far exceeded the feedback I’ve gotten in any other beta I’ve ever taken part in, even those run by large companies, so frankly I’m pretty happy.

And my attitude toward duffe was simply one of not udnerstanding what he’s compplaining about; all the information he says isn’t available clearly is, and can be found with little to no effort. So I don’t know why he’s grousing… maybe he’ll be happier with some other host and CMS.

jonhicks · 2005-02-19 23:26:35

> ubernostrum wrote:

> duffe: Go to Google. Type in “textpattern 1.0 weblog site:textdrive.com” and hit “I’m Feeling Lucky”.

> Oh look, it’s Jason mentioning something about clean URLs in 1.0. Wasn’t that hard?

Is it just me that didn’t find that an easy or intuitive place to look ? ;o)

Since when was there a textdrive blog? I guess since my site is hosted elsewhere that I don’t know about these things. Its great to have information about Textpattern mentioned somewhere, but it’s a shame it wasn’t here.

I don’t think the communication is awful BTW, just that it could be a bit better.

Niloc · 2005-02-19 23:48:08

There has been a TD blog for a while, just not talked much about on these forums, if at all until now.

watts · 2005-02-20 00:22:57

> I donâ

reid · 2005-02-20 00:29:39

I’ve been eating this free ice cream for nearly 11 months now. It’s been great. It still is, and I eat it every day. In fact, I used to get free ice cream from this other place, but they’ve started charging if you want more than a thimble full. And I simply will not pay for ice cream.

But I was promised more free ice cream in a new flavor. More than a month has passed, and I haven’t heard a damn thing from the free ice cream man. Who does he think he is treating his free ice cream customers like this?

I’ve supported free ice cream, by telling all my friends about it, and even giving some to a few of my clients. And I can find no reasonable explanation why the new flavor of free ice cream has not been delivered to me yet.

I’m about to take my taste buds elsewhere.

RussLipton · 2005-02-20 00:39:44

That’s exactly it.

It could be that Reid is complaining but if so, so what? He is entitled to get his (free) ice cream wherever he wants; whenever he wants. Not only that, if he gets it somewhere else, he can always come back and get free ice cream here later.

It isn’t really different when you buy software ice cream either. Don’t like it? Not a clear enough upgrade or support path? Buy some different ice cream.

Open source should be a victimless crime.

(I gladly pay for Starbucks’ Java Chip; when it’s on sale, the separate freezer gets stuffed. Cold Stone Creamery is excellent but prices are way out of line. I haven’t yet found any free ice cream except virtually).

Jeremie · 2005-02-20 01:35:52

> ubernostrum wrote:

> First of all, if you’re a TXD customer then you probably know that everybody there has been scrambling to keep the service running under the onslaught of spam, which should give you some clues about why there haven’t been many recent updates on TXP 1.0.

Since september 10 last year ? Not likely.

> Second, Jason has pointed out a couple times both there and in these forums that 1.0 was being audited for security.

That doesn’t imped (spelling ?) a RC3 release, witch is faster and easier to create than explaining to everyone what will be in 1.0 and how it will be implementend, and what will not.

Plus, it would help ones that don’t use comment, or have spam issues.

And finally, only a large scale and open test can prove one’s security. 500 heads are better than half a dozen :-) .

> All of this information and more can be easily found by a simple search

Test: “1.0 AND release AND features” as a TXP forum search, no results. “version AND 1 AND release AND features” no results. “next AND release AND features” return some results, without signal or the informations needed.

Jeremie · 2005-02-20 03:18:48

> AirBeagle wrote:

> And for the record, Damelon, we’re not ‘pissed off about shit like this;’ we’re concerned

Very true. Well, some days pissed off is not far away, but mostly is concern :-) .

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#469 2005-02-19 20:40:03

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#470 2005-02-19 21:01:24

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#471 2005-02-19 21:49:24

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#472 2005-02-19 22:45:58

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#473 2005-02-19 23:26:35

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#474 2005-02-19 23:48:08

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#475 2005-02-20 00:22:57

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#476 2005-02-20 00:29:39

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#477 2005-02-20 00:39:44

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#478 2005-02-20 01:35:52

Re: rc2 and 1.0

#479 2005-02-20 03:18:48

Re: rc2 and 1.0

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