Is this reasonable?

squaredeye · 2007-03-10 10:51:29

I was looking at this job description today and thought to myself? Self, how many people out there have an incredible design ability, can rip with XHTML and CSS, AND have a working knowledge of any programming language – RoR PHP MYSQL etc.?

Any thoughts good TXP people?

slim · 2007-03-10 15:38:58

It seems to me that webPeople are either designers (like yourself) or developers (like myself, kinda). Its the whole right-brained, left-brained thing. People who are proficient at both seem to be a rarity that you only find writing for ALA, or see their names in the CSS books and forward-looking webmags that deal with stretching the web into whatever shapes they can conjure. Hope they pay well.

Walker · 2007-03-10 15:50:17

yeah, there’s lots of those people.

(me?)

…hmmmm…except I don’t do “graphic design”. I tend to work on interface and interaction design.

Last edited by Walker (2007-03-10 15:51:02)

hakjoon · 2007-03-10 16:45:29

That isn’t as bad as the University jobs that want 6+ years in CSS, xHTML, Javascript, Coldfusion, PHP, ROR, SQL Super design skills all for the amazing rate of $30k a year.

A few jobs being a jack of all trades for places let’s you pick up all the relevant skills. You eventually focus more on the stuff that comes more easily. (For me that wasn’t design).

Also keep in mind that most people writing for ALA and stuff like that are hardly developers. They are designers that pick up some scripting skills along the way, because honestly you kind of have to.

mrdale · 2007-03-10 21:24:47

A few thoughts…

I’m a designer pretending to have extended abilities (just enough to get me in trouble). But often times I know enough about stuff to allow me to request and implement stuff pretty well. I think there are a lot of designers like me for whom TxP (and plugin developers like hack) make that bluff a lot easier.

I’d like to learn more (PHP, javascript), but I have such a limited time-budget that every time I approach that threshold I can just picture myself spending hours and hours more discretionary time on the computer. At that point I step back and decide that coaching my son’s basketball team is probably a better idea…

Last edited by mrdale (2007-03-10 21:26:07)

squaredeye · 2007-03-10 22:11:59

Interesting interesting. This is why I asked. Good discussion.
As I’m looking at the next steps in my own life, I am asking these questions, because I will be a coach of some kind in 5-7 years too. Hopefully not basketball :), hopefully some nerdy pottery class :)

I’d like to think I could continue to improve my user interface design skills, my html and css knowledge and implementation, and know enough about javascript and a little php or rails to know how and when to ask for help.

Ideally, I’d love to be part of a team where we all help hone eachother… ahh to dream… :)

hakjoon · 2007-03-11 00:36:26

ma_smith wrote:
Ideally, I’d love to be part of a team where we all help hone eachother… ahh to dream… :)

Teams are good. That’s one thing that keeps me in the company world vs being out on my own. Although you have done a great job interfacing with people over the net.

Move to VA we need someone with exactly your skillset. (I’m totally serious)

Last edited by hakjoon (2007-03-11 00:37:49)

NyteOwl · 2007-03-11 19:58:20

I had to chckle at the part about WCAG / WAI . After reading through the last draft of the guidelines I don’t think even the people who wrote the document could understand it :-)

Neko · 2007-03-12 00:30:25

hakjoon wrote:

Also keep in mind that most people writing for ALA and stuff like that are hardly developers. They are designers that pick up some scripting skills along the way, because honestly you kind of have to.

Agree. The only exception that comes in mind, without researching, is Shaun Inman, who every time produces killer designs and is a talented coder.

Jeremie · 2007-03-12 02:59:58

There are a lot of different profiles, and talent. This is not as straight as designer (in the “nowadays” meaning of the word) vs coder.

You have the actual design, in the original, canonical meaning of the word (not the graphics, but the whole creation and meeting—and further—your user expectations). You have the human handling component. The usability expert. The accessibility expert. And so on, and so on, and so on.

A couple of days ago, a small (big for it’s niche though) associative website ask me to help them with the new version of their site (which is 8 years old, and need some fresh air, better organization, etc.). I said “ok, but I won’t do graphics because I can’t, I won’t do coding because I can’t, and I won’t do CSS coding because I don’t have the time for it right now… if, and only if you have those skills already onboard, I’ll join and help you”.

The answer I got, which wasn’t a surprise really, was : “ok then, but what will you do? Isn’t that the whole thing?”.

Try to explain in very short word (this is non profit, friendly help, and I’m swamped with work) things like actual design, usability, user experience, accessibility, whipping the graphic team for fluid design mockups, whipping the coding team for valid and semantic html or xhtml, etc…

dbulli · 2007-03-13 18:47:57

At one point when the market was really bad people were asking about for designers who could code and coders who could design … and they might have thrown in a good cook too … they were greedy …

things are better now .. but knowing photoshop is different from being a designer … i am comfortable in photoshop, but i don’t think i want to be a designer … i just dabble…

hakjoon · 2007-03-13 19:08:22

In my experience any place that wants the sun moon and sky, doesn’t actually expect anyone with those qualifications because they normally aren’t paying enough. Non profits are notorious with this kind of stuff.

They can however be great opportunities to get a lot of good experience. Most of the stuff I learned was being a jack of all trades at various places.

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#1 2007-03-10 10:51:29

Is this reasonable?

#2 2007-03-10 15:38:58

Re: Is this reasonable?

#3 2007-03-10 15:50:17

Re: Is this reasonable?

#4 2007-03-10 16:45:29

Re: Is this reasonable?

#5 2007-03-10 21:24:47

Re: Is this reasonable?

#6 2007-03-10 22:11:59

Re: Is this reasonable?

#7 2007-03-11 00:36:26

Re: Is this reasonable?

#8 2007-03-11 19:58:20

Re: Is this reasonable?

#9 2007-03-12 00:30:25

Re: Is this reasonable?

#10 2007-03-12 02:59:58

Re: Is this reasonable?

#11 2007-03-13 18:47:57

Re: Is this reasonable?

#12 2007-03-13 19:08:22

Re: Is this reasonable?

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