*Basic* things, that should be included into the next TXP release

Michael · 2006-06-02 08:22:27

I am using TXP now for a really long time, but when reading the forum and experiencing the new releases, I realize a switch from a CMS that was sleek and slim to a CMS that is loaded with features at the expense of its former strengths.

Let me list some ideas here:

TXP and Textile is like one person, but still, Textile is not working properly in the current official TXP release.
TXP still lacks internal linking. There was a bunch of propositions like why not use something like "A link":345 where 345 is the ID of an article.
TXP is inconsistent in handling articles/comments/etc. Take the search-field: In articles, it’s on top. In comments, it’s on the bottom. Images, Files and Links even cannot be searched…
When looking at the Presentation-tab: It says “useful tags” if you are editing your template, but on the other hand, everyone here emphasizes to use forms. But if you change to forms, the “useful tags” do not seem as useful as somewhere else. Maybe we could create groups of tags that are somehow linked together and make them available everywhere inside TXP or make none at all, therefore leave more space for editing, but then the documentation should make a big step in the right direction?
Apropos space: Did anyone ever try to build a table in the tiny article-field? If you have more than four columns… wow!

So what is your opinion about that? In my eyes, TXP (in combination with some great plug-ins) is still the best CMS software I know of. But with every new release the strengths of TXP step back in favor of more and new functions (hopefully not, until there is no difference to others). I am really curious, what you are thinking about that. And to know whom we are listening to, please ad how long you are already using TXP.

In my case: Since it came up for the first time.

M.

Sencer · 2006-06-02 10:12:57

Thank you, for choosing and liking textpattern and for your suggestions. Let me comment on the things you raised:

Textile is of course working properly – it’s just that it does not have a hard spec, and there’s plenty of edge cases, undefined cases and yes, sometimes bugs that we don’t know about. If you want to help improve Textile, make specific bug reports. Alex has been busy trying to respond to those – however it’s not a trivial thing to get things right. We have plenty of test-cases and are working on continually improving it.

Internal Linking and search-consistency: While it is true, it is not a crucial thing. I understand you apparently feel very strongly for it. Yet, you should understand that there’s thousands of txp-users all who have their own and different pet-things they feel strongly about. If all of them “must be in the next release”, then, well, it would take a few years…

presentation tab – yes, there’s again truth to what you are saying. However those tagbuilders are generally used when people are starting to work with textpattern. Everybody I know who has used Textpattern for a while, writes out the tags – just like most people prefer to write their html instead of clicking around. One Request that many people feel similarly strongly about (as you feel about this), is to be able to edit their templates in their favourite editor and be able to upload templates via FTP – This implies they do not use tagbuilders most of the time. Before I am misunderstood: While I agree that improvements, especially for beginners, can be made, those are not crucial things.

Size of the article-box: 4-column-tables. That seems like pretty much an edge-case to be drawing general conclusions from. Most people, most of the time are writing text. You can also write a 10,000 word essay in an article-field – yet, it’s not a very comfortable thing to do.
IIRC there is plugins that allow you to resize the textarea to your liking.

In my eyes, TXP (in combination with some great plug-ins) is still the best CMS software I know of.

Thanks.

But with every new release the strengths of TXP step back in favor of more and new functions

Huh? More and new functions? Since the release of 4.0 about a year ago, most of the work has gone into bugfixing, and some enhancements wrt to heavily-complained about short-comings that had a bug-like nature. Given the general trend of requests and complaints, I think you are one of very few people to suggest that we’ve been moving too fast in term of features. Which, I guess, is a good thing, becaus it means, we’ve been able to balance things out somewhat (given that there’s complaints from both sides).

Which strengths do you feel we are stepping back from?

Michael · 2006-06-02 14:35:38

Thanks for the answer, Sencer!

Textile is of course working properly…
- I’d love to make specific bug reports and I already mentioned in some articles months ago that for example spans do not work properly, but just tell me: Where is the central point where I can post those bugs? Where is the central list, where I can read what already has been posted?

Internal Linking and search-consistency: While it is true, it is not a crucial thing.
- Okay. I felt it was a crucial think since I loved how TXP deals with links inside a site. We have the link_to_home, etc.-tabs which meant for me not to hardcode (do you call it this way?) links inside my own website. Maybe I got the philosophy behind TXP wrong about that. Sorry for that.

presentation tab – yes, there’s again truth to what you are saying. However those tagbuilders are generally used when people are starting to work with textpattern.
- Okay. Your point. To be honest, I too, do no longer use them. But sometimes, especially when it comes to tables, spans and so on in textile, I have to go to textism to find the information I need…

One Request that many people feel similarly strongly about (as you feel about this), is to be able to edit their templates in their favourite editor and be able to upload templates via FTP.
- Strange, but okay. I wonder how they will change their html against TXP-tags this way? I always create my templates with TopStyle (including articles, comments, etc.), copy that stuff into TXP and change the appropriate html with TXP-tags…

Size of the article-box: 4-column-tables. That seems like pretty much an edge-case to be drawing general conclusions from.
- Well, maybe, but what about an image with a flickr-link? What about a link to another blog – the whole thing gets really unreadable after a while. And I use a small iBook 14” (1024×768) and still the textarea is about 1/3 of the screen… But I have the luxury of a lot of whitespace left and right of it.

Most people, most of the time are writing text. You can also write a 10,000 word essay in an article-field – yet, it’s not a very comfortable thing to do.
- Sencer, please step back from “fixed at home blogging”. You know, I am blogging from internet cafés literally from all over the world and it is not always possible not to use the default textareas. I wanted to, but I did not since it is a very specific thing, propose something like the proposition of a diacritical code (or some self-define-possibility for TXP) so that TXP generates umlauts etc. similar to LaTeX (e.g. /Oe/sterreich becomes Österreich) – because if you are in countries like China, waiting for Outside-China-Sites can be a hard task.

Given the general trend of requests and complaints, I think you are one of very few people to suggest that we’ve been moving too fast in term of features. – Which strengths do you feel we are stepping back from?
- I suppose it’s only me feeling. I hear of announcements concerning this and that, of plug-ins concerning this and that, but the only thing that makes TXP different from all the rest out there is how it handles texts. You do not need a plugin to show dashes in different widths, but you have a e.g. german version that ignores german specifics on this topic. —- What I said just my feeling about that.

So what’s next?
If you could point me to a central point where I can post my examples when textile does not work properly, I would be thankfull. And I would really very much like to contribute. Let’s do one by one. And that’s the first point.

M.

zem · 2006-06-02 22:33:41

If you could point me to a central point where I can post my examples when textile does not work properly, I would be thankfull.

The Textile Forum.

blumie607 · 2006-06-06 22:56:38

presentation tab – yes, there’s again truth to what you are saying. However those tagbuilders are generally used when people are starting to work with textpattern.

Okay. Your point. To be honest, I too, do no longer use them. But sometimes, especially when it comes to tables, spans and so on in textile, I have to go to textism to find the information I need…

A great place to get information about Tags and how they work is Textbook

blumie607 · 2006-06-06 22:57:37

presentation tab – yes, there’s again truth to what you are saying. However those tagbuilders are generally used when people are starting to work with textpattern. ** Okay. Your point. To be honest, I too, do no longer use them. But sometimes, especially when it comes to tables, spans and so on in textile, I have to go to textism to find the information I need…

A great place to get information about Tags and how they work is Textbook

hcgtv · 2006-06-07 00:15:01

When we say the next Textpattern, I assume we mean the stable branch, not crockery.

This is my list:

A way to filter out IP’s from the logs – yes I’ve tried the examples and I can’t get it to work. I used to use Dean’s refer.php on some sites and it was really easy to exclude in the config file.
XMLRPC – should be added to SVN already so we can test.
An easier way to install the layouts at TextGarden – but keep the old style on file, just in case.
The site name on the top row in the admin section.

Mary · 2006-06-07 23:06:53

XMLRPC – should be added to SVN already so we can test.

Er… Bert? <notextile>—></notextile> XML-RPC support for Textpattern 4.0.3 is here

hcgtv · 2006-06-07 23:22:05

Mary wrote:

Er… Bert? <notextile>—></notextile> XML-RPC support for Textpattern 4.0.3 is here

Yes, I’ve read that, just wondering why it hasn’t hit SVN yet?

Mary · 2006-06-07 23:57:28

It has. See under “Note for subversion users:”.

zem · 2006-06-08 00:17:43

Just a quick comment on things that should be done: if you’d like a new feature or plugin, Team Textpattern can build it for you. And include it in the next release, if that’s feasible and appropriate.

Textpattern CMS

Textpattern CMS support forum

#1 2006-06-02 08:22:27