[contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

neutrino · 2006-03-03 01:00:44

@ Bastian

With all the discussion going on about the subway map I forgot to ask you about the technology behind the Google map project you did. I did one one a while back

So I’m aware of the basics but I don’t understand “how” it works at all. It occured to me that the google map algorithms would be perfect for our subway map if only we could hijack them and feed them our own coordinates from our imaginary land. Rather than the “real” world the TXP World. Course I might be dreaming. I never really know.

I put a zip of google map images (kind of close up) of a few cities up online. Or else zoom in on a city next time you go to google maps

Last edited by neutrino (2006-03-03 01:10:50)

Destry · 2006-03-03 06:35:58

neutrino wrote: …it’s going to come down to what gets done rather than what gets envisioned.

Truer words were never spoken.

anark wrote: I suggest Neutrino start a Yahoo group that all interested parties can sign up to. We’d then work out a blueprint and submit that blueprint back to this Board for discussion before we build anything.

Ummm…This should be visible right from the get-go, and all along the way. If you hide the activity off the beaten path, you risk losing a lot of potential good feedback, even if it’s just from casual viewers. I would rather suggest a project is added in the wiki, under Feature Requests which is the whole point of that wiki partition (developing ideas and products). You can upload images there, PDFs, etc, and everyone can easily discuss the working document via the discussions page.

Having said that, I will try to remain quiet now ;)

Last edited by Destry (2006-03-03 06:38:10)

neutrino · 2006-03-03 14:58:24

Anark wrote:

I suggest Neutrino start a Yahoo group that all interested parties can sign up to. We’d then work out a blueprint and submit that blueprint back to this Board for discussion before we build anything.

Destry wrote:

Ummm…This should be visible right from the get-go, and all along the way. If you hide the activity off the beaten path, you risk losing a lot of potential good feedback, even if it’s just from casual viewers. I would rather suggest a project is added in the wiki, under Feature Requests which is the whole point of that wiki partition (developing ideas and products). You can upload images there, PDFs, etc, and everyone can easily discuss the working document via the discussions page.

That sounds like a plan to me. I sort of have an adversion to yahoo. More even than to the wiki ;).

Last edited by neutrino (2006-03-03 14:59:28)

Bastian · 2006-03-03 15:37:44

@ neutrino

> I forgot to ask you about the technology behind the Google map project you did

I used gmapez to display the markers.
I tried to write the javascript on my own, but the idea of Chouse to parse xhtml by JS to display to markes is so elegant, that i quit writing my own JS.

Trie to visit the TXP Blogmap without Javascript.
The Blogs are not styled at the moment, but they are accessible.

> It occured to me that the google map algorithms would be perfect for our subway map
Not a bad idea, for drowing the subway-lines perhaps somthing like the gmap polyline function

> if only we could hijack them
Lets say: Get inspired by them :)

Bastian · 2006-03-03 16:19:58

I played a little: Very basic map with polygons and marker

BTW: Google is not the only one who draws lines with javascript:

walterzorn.com
selfhtml.org
silver-daggers.co.uk
p01.org

Now we have php + flash, php + generating jpg and js to choose from.

Last edited by Bastian (2006-03-03 18:32:40)

Bastian · 2006-03-03 17:31:19

Here comes the hattrick:

Perhaps we thought to complicated.
Subway maps like this one consist of a limited number of patterns.
For emample horizontal and vertical lines, curves and stations.

Textpattern -> subway map made with patterns…mmh…?? Aah:
Tubepattern

This tubepattern maps i made with pure css and some png. Dont view with IE.

To display the 45 degree lines proper the patterns should be hexagonal like this gameboard.

Last edited by Bastian (2006-03-03 22:48:57)

colak · 2006-03-03 18:28:50

<blockquote>alexandra wrote:

> mary wrote:

> Don’t start with a design first.

I slightly disagree here, mary. From working professionally on many projects like this the workflow usually is:

write a concept (=> keyinfos you like to display, a chart here)
make a [rough] design (extendable)
decide for the app if you did not already

To get a designed worked out pretty soon, visualizing what you are up to, is always inspiring and kicks the project. Quick feeling of success.

[great sig, mary ROFL :)]</blockquote>

Alexandra I’m afraid I agree with mary. Design should come last. The design basically encuptulates the concept. Without a concept there is no design, just function.

neutrino · 2006-03-04 17:12:26

@Everyone I’m playing catchup in the real world and online with some other projects so I expect to be a little distant from these forums for a few days to a week or so.

Bastian Excellent work and exciting. I am so glad we have you on board. C.L. <—clapping and whistling for what Bastain has done @

@colak

>anark wrote:

it’d be a three-tiered thing, with the topmost tier showing all the different Efforts: sites, projects, groups, each with a very short description. Click on any of them and you get to the second tier: a more detailed presentation: past achievements, future aims, present state of play, the toys being played with and tools being tooled with, who’s involved in what capacity and who’s in charge of the Effort. Then, clickable from the second tier, the third tier would be bio pages with information on who these people are, what they’re doing, which Efforts they’ve been contributing to, and how they can be contacted.

Not strictly necessary, but maybe an interesting design challenge: the upper two tiers could be done visually, say the top tier as a Map of TextLand with DevCity as the capital and all the other Efforts as cities. The cities, second tier, could be rendered as subway maps, each station representing a contributor, different subway lines representing different aspects of the work done. Fanciful. Whatever.

The concept started here. with a post Anark made. I believe all the info (concept wise) you are looking for is here (in links you’ll have to follow) more or less — it is just spread out on the forum and I agree we (I) need to bring it together into one coherent (hopefully) location on the web which as far a I can tell now will be a wiki page and a new forum thread (which I still need to start).

So how I see it simply is a “directory or table of contents of TXP-related entities as they currently exist on the web” as an XML file which can be imported and visually displayed by “a” technology by which someone available is skilled. [that’s off the top my my head and I will re-write that] And Basitian appears to be that shining example, able to explore and manifest multiple technologies into compliance. I’m excited by what I see.

@everyone

Beyond this, anyone who has a better or more coherent version of this nebulous concept down on paper, bring it on. As far as I can see it’s a map and I have a hundred generic ideas about maps floating around in my head for reference — I just assumed we all did. What Basitian is doing is the most active manifestation of the map that I see. Concepts give direction but coding and visuals bring life. And color is a breath of fresh air in a text-based, code-centric environment like this forum. Hopefully we will balance the two here and not demand that we start with one person’s orientation to a craft versus another’s. Bottom line is that who’s here is who is working on this project. And the project has tons of room to grow. I work in local gov so I’m very familar how too much planning kills and stifles. So again I agree with you all, provisionally.

Edit: Also, concept people. If any of you have a conceptual framework you are suggesting that we follow let us see it. Then maybe we can find someone to provide the answers to the questions you have.

Last edited by neutrino (2006-03-07 01:22:40)

neutrino · 2006-03-04 17:50:13

I registered us an official project.

If there are any problems with who I included or if you want a specific title or role, let me know. There was some talk elsewhere that at some point we might have private forums here on the TXP boards to discuss things without a lot of drop in traffic. If we do that I think we will need to post back out of the forum some official info periodically so everyone else can keep up. For now it seems an unneccessary layer. Up to the majority tho. Those of you on the project feel free to email me. If you do though let me know what of what you tell me I can share (in a paraphased or bulleted version) with the larger community.

neutrino · 2006-03-07 01:33:52

Disclaimer: This is just for fun. It is by no means complete or correct. I just threw in a few people’s sites that I could remember. I was off-line when I did it so I even messed up Destry’s original suggestion of lines . . . anyway, for a little color, a tentative visual.

Destry · 2006-03-07 10:22:00

Neutrino…that’s interesting. I had not considered adding stops for the perso sites of [classification here]. In any case, your nifty chart makes me think of one of my own; I’m going to give it a run for kicks…need a couple of days.

Also, if there are no objections, I would like to get this project established in the wiki, where among other things, we can put all the chart contributions together for easier viewing and comparison. Again, give me a couple days to frame the house.

One last thing so it’s not overlooked: Since mary has made it clear that adding anything new to textpattern.com is pretty much out of the question, I have been thinking the next best place would be textpattern.net (right at the root). See active discussion.

Last edited by Destry (2006-03-07 10:23:32)

neutrino · 2006-03-07 13:08:17

Destry wrote:

Neutrino…that’s interesting. I had not considered adding stops for the perso sites of [classification here]. In any case, your nifty chart makes me think of one of my own; I’m going to give it a run for kicks…need a couple of days.

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with. Yeah, the personal sites I thought of as TextStars, extra active or talented, maybe the top ten or 15 over achievers.

Also, if there are no objections, I would like to get this project established in the wiki, where among other things, we can put all the chart contributions together for easier viewing and comparison. Again, give me a couple days to frame the house.

Very good. That’ll probably be the easiest way to get that concept draft done.

One last thing so it’s not overlooked: Since mary has made it clear that adding anything new to textpattern.com is pretty much out of the question, I have been thinking the next best place would be textpattern.net (right at the root). See active discussion.

I’ve been watching this conversation. It seems only logical to consolidate our efforts. And the dot net site seems like a good pick. There was a suggestion that we consider Textgarden for the mapping project as the map could be based on an outdoor metaphor rather than on subway lines. It’s also been mentioned that we look at other visual metaphors like department stores and museums.

Just food for thought. I’m going to go back to working on the mind map for the time being.

Destry · 2006-03-07 18:12:06

Destry wrote: One last thing so it’s not overlooked: Since mary has made it clear that adding anything new to textpattern.com is pretty much out of the question, I have been thinking the next best place would be textpattern.net (right at the root). See active discussion.

neutrino wrote: There was a suggestion that we consider Textgarden for the mapping project as the map could be based on an outdoor metaphor rather than on subway lines. It’s also been mentioned that we look at other visual metaphors like department stores and museums. … Just food for thought. I’m going to go back to working on the mind map for the time being.

That’s cool. TextGarden works. I guess I missed that along the line. When it’s all said and done, underneath the flash and gloss, I keep thinking of this as a means of finding information easily…a kind of pretty index, I guess, and “books” and “indexes” go hand in hand. In any case, I’m a strong supporter of TextGarden, so that’s fine with me. I just wanted to offer the place (textpattern.net) should it be wanted for the map/index. That’s not a place I would offer many other projects, but a top-level index would be warranted. I think you’re right though, if it goes really graphic or whatever, then textpattern.net is probably not ideal.

I still think we could plan the project though in the wiki. I’ll work on that.

Last edited by Destry (2006-03-07 18:31:36)

thebombsite · 2006-03-07 20:01:08

I have no problem with using TextGarden for this but I should remind you all that it is going to be moved to it’s own server (Sivert) and I understand that this could happen anytime around now, which may lead to a certain amount of “downtime”. I also have the problem that, due to the move, I don’t have full access to certain things such as phpMyAdmin which means that backing-up before making any changes is a no-go at the moment.

neutrino · 2006-03-08 14:13:32

Destry wrote:

I keep thinking of this as a means of finding information easily…a kind of pretty index, I guess, and “books” and “indexes” go hand in hand.

Yes, the information is predominant. That’s why I’ll be concentrating on the map for the time being. In fact a number of us can use the Freemind program to very quicky produce numerous maps and/or edit one another’s. I’ll put together a little primer on using Freemind and delicious together. It’s a great little combo, very fast, no learning curve at all.

Honesty, the end result could be a Freemind map exported as XHTML. The Freemind maps can link to other FM maps. And/or someone could take our “index” and use it as a database for an intense graphic project to host at Textgarden. I do think in keeping in spirit with the TEXTness of Textpattern that a TextTOC at TEXTpattern.net is totally within the realm of this project and one of its major goals. If folks find a way to make this lightly graphical and the powers that be like it, all the better.

All we can do is see what happens as the project evolves. Plato’s horses. :)

I still think we could plan the project though in the wiki. I’ll work on that.

Edit:

@Stuart

I have no problem with using TextGarden for this but I should remind you all that it is going to be moved to it’s own server (Sivert)

Very nice remembrance naming the server Sivert. There’s no rush on our end and no decisions have been made about what the end result will even be. We’re just talking at the moment but it’s good to know that you’re open to the idea. Good luck with the move and feel free to join our discussion.

Last edited by neutrino (2006-03-08 14:35:13)

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#31 2006-03-03 01:00:44

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#32 2006-03-03 06:35:58

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#33 2006-03-03 14:58:24

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#34 2006-03-03 15:37:44

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#35 2006-03-03 16:19:58

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#36 2006-03-03 17:31:19

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#37 2006-03-03 18:28:50

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#38 2006-03-04 17:12:26

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#39 2006-03-04 17:50:13

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#40 2006-03-07 01:33:52

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#41 2006-03-07 10:22:00

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#42 2006-03-07 13:08:17

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#43 2006-03-07 18:12:06

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#44 2006-03-07 20:01:08

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

#45 2006-03-08 14:13:32

Re: [contrib] Project: TXP Subway Map

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