comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

nardo · 2007-04-20 03:29:11

re: http://thresholdstate.com/threshold/4311/cast-your-vote-textpattern-membership

I voted “Nothing, I’d just like to help support continued Textpattern development” – but inclusion in site list and/or swag wouldn’t be a problem

Feel that exclusive plugins, documentation, content – wouldn’t fit the spirit of this endeavour – already there is Team Textpattern-generated work, and the client has the choice whether to retain or release the plugin/mod

Do feel that additional support would be a feature worth paying for – but wonder how much time/money that would cost to set-up & maintain to be effective?

Last edited by nardo (2007-04-20 03:29:50)

lee · 2007-04-20 07:30:08

My thoughts are that if you need an income in order to devote time to working on TP then maybe it’s time to take on more core developers who can give their time for free. There are already opportunity’s to make an income by way of ransoming plugins, which I believe Zem pioneered and also subscription to plugin updates which again was Zem’s idea. Turning TP into a partially commercial product feels wrong. But if it happens I’ll pay up.

Last edited by lee (2007-04-20 07:31:03)

zem · 2007-04-20 07:56:06

then maybe it’s time to take on more core developers who can give their time for free

Sure. Bring them on. Ask them to send patches.

lee · 2007-04-20 08:03:56

If someone sends a patch does that make them part of the core team? Do they get too partake in the wider decisions, for example which patches make it into the core, that seem to be in the realm of Kursor, Mary and yourself? Please don’t get me wrong here, you guys do the business and you do it damn well.

zem · 2007-04-20 08:05:18

If they’re willing to spend the time, then sure.

lee · 2007-04-20 08:12:53

Great, then maybe there should be an announcement, or the latest announcement could be updated, asking for new core developers – then perhaps TP can stay free for all. And those needing to make an income from TP can go the plugin/subscription route. You up for that?

zem · 2007-04-20 10:03:48

Here’s how to join the core dev team: submit patches. Keep submitting them. When we can’t keep up anymore, we’ll give you svn commit access.

Neko · 2007-04-20 10:07:29

From my POV I wouldn’t mind a model similar to that of Expression Engine: a free downloadable “core” version and a “pro” version which costs money (by yearly subscription or license purchase) and offers more.

Last edited by Neko (2007-04-20 12:22:12)

nardo · 2007-04-20 10:58:25

a monthly message from Dean would be worth subscribing for!!

lee · 2007-04-20 11:20:39

zem wrote:

Here’s how to join the core dev team: submit patches. Keep submitting them. When we can’t keep up anymore, we’ll give you svn commit access.

Will these new core developers also be able to take part in the decision making process in the same way as yourself, Mary and Kursor – i.e be of equal standing?

If the current core team need to make money to pay for some of the time they give to TP, then why not take more developers into the core team to spread the work load?

I’m not quite getting why all of a sudden part of TP needs to become commercial, when I expect there are brilliant developers out there who might like to be part of the core team and give some of their time for free. If the likes of rudd and wilshire are not interested then I suppose I’m barking up the wrong tree again and I’ll shut up.

zem · 2007-04-20 12:02:34

Will these new core developers also be able to take part in the decision making process in the same way as yourself, Mary and Kursor – i.e be of equal standing?

If they make good decisions, sure. That’s why we need to see patches.

I’m not quite getting why all of a sudden part of TP needs to become commercial

Who said part of Textpattern was becoming commercial?

when I expect there are brilliant developers out there who might like to be part of the core team and give some of their time for free.

Great! Ask them to send us some patches please.

Last edited by zem (2007-04-20 12:09:24)

squaredeye · 2007-04-20 13:15:57

Alex,

I TOTALLY understand the need for income in order to support the growth of Textpattern. As a freelancer that makes sense to me more than some. :)
4.05 itself will be not be a membership upgrade from 4.04 correct? It is that 4.05 may have additional features (or some of the other things you’ve asked for votes on) that would make a subscription attractive.
You’ve commented above that patches are a good way of knowing if the patcher is a good candidate for joining the dev team. Is it possible that it is upsetting to some people that the possibility for inclusion seems so arbitrary or done without a system? It doesn’t feel transparent to me personally. Not that transparency is your goal, but might I suggest that if the dev team wishes to maintain the support of some of the core players in the community, that you might develop a more systematic understanding or approach to being part of that team? In addition, I would think that the ability to patch something is only one quality of what makes a good part of a leadership team for TXP? Would you agree?

This has been a common theme for those with disagreaments with the team. The fact that the distance between the devs and the users isn’t well deliniated. It can feel foggy. I would think you could garner some serious support of your efforts if as suggested before you worked to develop a roadmap for where TXP is heading (subject to change :). It wouldn’t even need to have more than a very basic timeline (also subject to change).

Therefore:
I would formally like to request a seat on the Development Team. I would like to participate in the following ways:

help plan a roadmap for future releases of TXP
Develop a clear framework for how the Development Team interracts with the community:
Help think through the conceptual qualities of the CMS from a designer/developer point of view

I’ll submit a specific request to Team Textpattern as well.

Matthew

colak · 2007-04-20 13:32:26

Firstly let me say that I agree with Matthew who said it so much more eloquently than I could and although I earn no income from the web, I’m not against a paid version of txp as I can only imagine the hours of work been offered by the developers for free. I nevertheless have some thoughts regarding a paid version

the price:)… Nothing mentioned yet…
the method of payment. ie if paypal is used a sizable number of members from this community will just NOT be able to ‘buy’ it due to paypal’s country restrictions
The method suggested which is based on a monthly basis… What about ‘selling’ it like other software. What happens to someone who doesn’t pay their monthly dues? Is their site going to go off line? Will there be a message on the screen? Will they have to stand in the corner of the room wearing a pointy hat?
SVN is currently discouraged on Live sites. Paying members would expect official minor updates on a regular basis. This to me means zipped files either posted or otherwise made available to them.
- This also might imply that another svn should be maintained which will just deal with these ‘official’ patches.
My main worry about the paid version is that it might divide this community.
- There will be those using pro
- And those who don’t

zem wrote… twice in this thread

Ask them to send us some patches please.

I seem to remember that Dean, when he was ready to give up on txp, asked a series of developers, including you, to take over the software. The transition was gradual before Dean has eventually disappeared from this forum.

I also seem to remember the rc1 days where there were only a handful of plugin developers around. (One of the main criticisms against txp at the time was the limited number of plugins it had)

This is no longer the case. I understand how a plugin developer is different to a software one but this is where all our current developers started. Some months ago there was a discussion in this forum to expand the txp team but there was resistance from both some members of the community as well as the team. I think that today, txp has the most php savvy people it ever had. And the list is growing. Did the txp team invite anyone to join them in their efforts? Via email, not through the forum.

I do not wish to fight with anyone or even sound ungrateful to the great job the txp team is doing. Txp (and this community) has changed the way I see the web and web publishing. And I think that this is true for a lot of people here. I also think that (if I were a programmer) I would probably find it very difficult to be as gracious as you people are:)

This community to me is a melting pot of ideas re web publishing (and other issues:). My worry is that this might change if a paid version is released.

As I said before…

I would be willing to pay for the pro version as I respect the amount of work the developers have put into this
I have my doubts re payment methods
I have my ~~doubts~~ respectful reservations whereas all avenues have been explored thoroughly enough before this decision re paid versions was taken

nardo · 2007-04-20 13:48:08

The poll is trying to guage what people would like in return IF they were to shell out some dollars & dineros…

let’s keep it on-track!!

Neko · 2007-04-20 14:03:05

OMG not another thread full of Textile-formatted lists, requests for wikis, timelines, frameworks, some other crap.

Just tell me when 4.0.5 is ready and how much is the optional yearly subscription amount.

Last edited by Neko (2007-04-20 16:19:09)

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#1 2007-04-20 03:29:11

comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#2 2007-04-20 07:30:08

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#3 2007-04-20 07:56:06

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#4 2007-04-20 08:03:56

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#5 2007-04-20 08:05:18

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#6 2007-04-20 08:12:53

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#7 2007-04-20 10:03:48

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#8 2007-04-20 10:07:29

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#9 2007-04-20 10:58:25

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#10 2007-04-20 11:20:39

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#11 2007-04-20 12:02:34

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#12 2007-04-20 13:15:57

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#13 2007-04-20 13:32:26

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#14 2007-04-20 13:48:08

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

#15 2007-04-20 14:03:05

Re: comments on Reader poll: Textpattern Membership

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