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#25 2006-11-17 20:20:51

hakjoon
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From: Arlington, VA
Registered: 2004-07-29
Posts: 1,634
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hcgtv wrote:
How would you like to crack open your PS3 or Wii boxes and find books with titles like 3D animation and 3D modeling with Maya that are required reading before you play your first game?

But in this analogy Textpattern is Maya and your website is the PS3/Wii. You don’t need to know Textpattern to use a site built with it, but you need to learn it to build a site using it.

Even with something like Joomla and Drupal you aren’t going to just install and go. The learning curve with Drupal is fairly steep too. (I’ve never seriously tried Joomla).

I’m kind of with Maniqui and Els on this one. It seems that for the instant site you have Blogger, MT, Wordpress. I like that TXP is sort of in the middle. Although I would like an easier way to move themes I build offline to my live site.


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#26 2006-11-17 20:33:21

soulship
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From: Always Sunny Charleston
Registered: 2004-04-30
Posts: 669
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hcgtv wrote:
How would you like to crack open your PS3 or Wii boxes and find books with titles like 3D animation and 3D modeling with Maya that are required reading before you play your first game?

hakjoon wrote:
But in this analogy Textpattern is Maya and your website is the PS3/Wii. You don’t need to know Textpattern to use a site built with it, but you need to learn it to build a site using it.

I must be a dork. To me textpattern*/illustrator/flash etc etc *is the playstation.

I am having to learn swift 3d on the fly right now to get some material for a presentation and to me half the fun is figuring out how things work and the sense of satisfaction when I do. But I do not want to discount Burt’s point either, because I am a dork, and 99.999% of people don’t want to look at this code crap. They just want their M-TV and they want it to work out o’ the box.

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#27 2006-11-17 22:07:59

hakjoon
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From: Arlington, VA
Registered: 2004-07-29
Posts: 1,634
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

soulship wrote:
I must be a dork. To me textpattern*/illustrator/flash etc etc *is the playstation.

Yeah well I’m kind of in that boat too. I pretty much gave up computer games when I got a copy of Lightwave3D as I wanted to spend all my time on the computer in LW and not playing Mechwarrior.

Although I don’t know that it’s quite the same for everyone else. Swift3D is cool though. Are you using the standalone one or one of the plugins for Max and LW?


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#28 2006-11-17 22:22:14

hcgtv
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From: Key Largo, Florida
Registered: 2005-11-29
Posts: 2,722
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hakjoon wrote:

Although I would like an easier way to move themes I build offline to my live site.

Ditto.

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#29 2006-11-18 10:45:42

Destry
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From: Haut-Rhin
Registered: 2004-08-04
Posts: 4,909
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

The point I was trying to make about books is that it provides exposure to the system (regardless of the technical aspects) into market circles that otherwise don’t stumble across Txp. Yes, those circles are out there, and they are not all tech idiots like you might be quick to think.

Like hakjoon, pointed out, Drupal is not any easier, in fact it has a steeper curve than Txp, but yet there it is at the top of the heap. Why? It’s got books, man, lots of books (and seniority), which would suggest people are willing to read good docs to learn something if those docs are available.

Oh, and I’m in the Txp camp that likes the system as is…as a clean slate, and not a push-the-one-button-to-inflate-instant-design approach. But that’s just me, and I can roll with the future.

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#30 2006-11-18 15:14:43

hakjoon
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From: Arlington, VA
Registered: 2004-07-29
Posts: 1,634
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

Now I’m all excited about this book. The one thing we have to remember is that Drupal and Joomla are a lot older then TXP. And Drupal specially is a huge swiss army knife. As flexible as TXP is it does not do everything Drupal can do yet.


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#31 2006-11-18 16:05:13

hcgtv
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From: Key Largo, Florida
Registered: 2005-11-29
Posts: 2,722
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

Destry wrote:

Oh, and I’m in the Txp camp that likes the system as is…as a clean slate, and not a push-the-one-button-to-inflate-instant-design approach.

That’s because you are a designer :)

Both Joomla! and Drupal are harder systems to master than Textpattern, that’s a given, But what they each have is an easy way for users to ditch the default look and pick a new style for their site. As they become more acquainted with the inner workings, they either modify the look themselves or pay someone to do a fresh new style. I’ve seen this time and time again, go ask Andreas Viklund how much extra work his templates have brought him.

That is all I’m trying to say, users want to pick a different look for their apps no matter what they run, whether it’s Winamp or Wordpress. If they can’t, they’ll go elsewhere and who loses out?

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#32 2006-11-18 17:32:21

Destry
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From: Haut-Rhin
Registered: 2004-08-04
Posts: 4,909
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hakjoon wrote: Now I’m all excited about this book.

There will be a review at the TXP Mag, when it’s made available to us, but I suspect most community folks will buy a copy anyway just for the nostalgia of it.

The one thing we have to remember is that Drupal and Joomla are a lot older then TXP.

Yep, that’s the other key point, which is what I meant by “seniority.”

And Drupal specially is a huge swiss army knife. As flexible as TXP is it does not do everything Drupal can do yet.

This is starting to circle back to similar discussions in the past. Some folks don’t ever want to see Txp go that “Swiss army knife” way. I’m one. If that stuff is available as plugins, fine, but I hope for a clean, lightweight, native Txp until the cows come home. I’d rather build-up (add-on) as each project requires it than have to routinely strip down every time.

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#33 2006-11-18 17:50:45

hakjoon
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From: Arlington, VA
Registered: 2004-07-29
Posts: 1,634
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Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

Destry wrote:
This is starting to circle back to similar discussions in the past.

We seem to do that a lot.

Some folks don’t ever want to see Txp go that “Swiss army knife” way. I’m one. If that stuff is available as plugins, fine, but I hope for a clean, lightweight, native Txp until the cows come home. I’d rather build-up (add-on) as each project requires it than have to routinely strip down every time.

To be fair Drupal takes that approach. The base install is fairly minimal and the other functionality (forums, multi user blogs, image galleries etc) are all distributed as modules.


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#34 2006-11-18 18:02:17

Destry
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From: Haut-Rhin
Registered: 2004-08-04
Posts: 4,909
Website

Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hakjoon wrote: To be fair Drupal takes that approach.

T’is true. I like Drupal, but nevertheless I just never seem to have a need for it.

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#35 2006-11-18 23:18:59

wet
Developer Emeritus
From: Schoerfling, Austria
Registered: 2005-06-06
Posts: 3,323
Website Mastodon

Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

I am happy with all the traction Joomla gets from this award ;-)

As long as Joomla has to fix such basic issues, my clients are happy with their Textpattern powered sites and the exposure on the search engines they get for free, while others are running circles round this topic.

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#36 2006-11-21 15:13:22

soulship
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From: Always Sunny Charleston
Registered: 2004-04-30
Posts: 669
Website

Re: Packt Publishing Open Source CMS awards

hakjoon wrote: Swift3D is cool though. Are you using the standalone one or one of the plugins for Max and LW?

The standalone has progressed by leaps and bounds, that’s what i’m using. Most of what I use it for is direct importing into Flash 8, of animated 3-d objects, logos, and the like. It makes me look brilliant without ever having to open up 3d-max :)

destry wrote: It’s got books, man, lots of books (and seniority), which would suggest people are willing to read good docs to learn something if those docs are available.

I would agree, but I would also argue that Drupal needs lots of books, because the learning curve is so steep.

Bert wrote: But what they each have is an easy way for users to ditch the default look and pick a new style for their site.

Exactly why they are so well received. someone here has already made an easy themer, we just need to dissect it and make it into an admin side plugin that rips the theme, packages up the pages, forms, styles, plugins and makes an ‘executable.’

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